What is with the John Gruber versus Paul Thurrott Obsession?

I just noticed that there’s a lot of queries about John Gruber an Paul Thurrott here. Then again, out of all the people who wasted took their time reading what I posted, only 2 commented so far.

Well, at least one person is interested in the cover art for 2012 movie.

Paul Thurrott fans must be fuming because John Gruber called him a “dick” at Daring Fireball. If John Gruber truly hates Paul Thurrott, he wouldn’t be giving Thurrott a lot of traffic off Daring Fireball. Ain’t that a paradox? Did I use the term “paradox” correctly?

I would like to produce a video of an open debate between John Gruber and Paul Thurrott. I don’t have the budget to fly them to Los Angeles, but I’d do Skype with both of them to let them have at it.

John and Paul, how about it? It’s going to be a good and informative entertainment.

Editor’s notes:

  • Paul Thurrott is perceived as a Microsoft lackey based on his own actions despite of Thurrott’s half-assed denial.
  • John Gruber is known as an Apple Superfan, who might have a direct line to Steve Jobs. Yeah. Steve Jobs once refer to John Gruber for an explanation.

Note to Leo Laporte:

Leo, you know both Gruber and Thurrott, but I claim this idea for having both of them squaring off on video. If you want to produce it, let me know.


Join the Conversation


  1. I’d say if you listened to Windows Weekly for the last 3-4 years you’d know that Paul has done his fair share of MS bashing. Prior to 2010 I think he was really negative on the direction MS was taking. Windows 7, Windows Phone 7, Xbox 360/Kinect have softened him a little bit this year but hes given it to MS quite a bit.

    1. I listened to Windows Weekly since episode 1. What you called as “Microsoft Bashing” by Paul Thurrott are merely backpedaling from his own statements. He latter called Windows Vista as a “flop” after Windows 7 was out. Same stories with Windows Mobile 6.1 and 6.5.

      If Thurrott were truly critical about Microsoft, why he is practically quiet about Microsoft suing Motorola? What about Microsoft asserting the patent against Open Source Communities? What about Microsoft “signing patent deal” with HTC over Android Licensing?

      I never said Thurrott’s a “Windows Guy” but he is a Microsoft Lackey, whipping boy, cheerleader, analog to Rus Limbaugh to GOP. Thurrott was a huge Amiga fanboy (I really hate using the term “fanboy”) and got hurt by its demise. He’s blaming a lot of it on Apple.

      Do you even remember Thurrott going off on Google and Steve Jobs on windows Weekly for no apparent reasons at all? Do you even remember Thurrott bitching about Apple’s “Get A Mac” ads and saying that he doesn’t like lies? At the same time he thinks that the latest of anything Microsoft is putting out are perfect just like Windows Phone 7.

      It is in his own interest to praise Windows (insert edition here) and Windows Phone 7. He is selling the books. I feel sorry for Rafael Rivera for taking the back-seat to Thurrott. He’s the one actually hacking Windows 7 away.

      As for Gruber calling Thurrott some names, it was not something new. He called Thurrott a “jackass” before. Well then again, Gruber called everyone some kinda names. If you don’t like it, tell it to Gruber. For sure that Gruber is not nice, but he is honest about it.

      In the end, I just don’t understand why a small subset of readers are obsessed about the so called Gruber versus Thurrott story. I guess I just found the answers, thanks to a few comments here.

  2. I’d agree with Abdul. Paul has done his fair share of MS bashing, including questioning whether or not Ballmer is the right guy to lead the company, their stupidity when it comes to naming products, their lack of focus for products…..etc etc. To say this is ‘back peddling’ on his earlier statements isnt entirely correct and depends on the context. For example, Paul reviews a lot of products (both MS products and Non-MS products) either prior to release or upon the initial release of the product. His initial statements are simply just that. Initial statement/observations/opinions. Coming back to an earlier review article, or giving an opinion on the product AFTER its been on sale for a while without doubt will result in a different opinion, simply because of improving updates (software/firmware etc) but more importantly the reaction of the public will be known, which ultimately determines whether a product is successful or not.

    You highlight paul saying Vista was a flop as back peddling on his part, but that is what Vista was, a flop. Not because it didnt sell well (which it did), but because of the perceived bugginess/incompatibility of it (regardless of whether or not that was true).

    I’ve never seen Paul praise any MS product, without also giving some misgivings/ how it can be improved/fixed etc for example Windows 7 is the best version of the OS to date (which is natural, considering its the latest version, one would expect to move forward and be better) yet Paul still points out oddities about it/things that could be changed to make it better etc.

    Also, i dont get the whole ‘Thurrott is a MS lackey’ etc, what about Alex Lyndsay on Macbreak weekly? he’s buying an apple product before its even announced, regardless of what it is?! (thats not to say apple products aren’t worth buying btw) Does that mean hes an apple lackey/cheerleader etc?

    Anyway, just to answer you, i only came across this site because Leo mentioned on both Macbreak weekly and windows weekly something Gruber said about Thurrott (about his how to fix the ipad article)and i wanted to know what it was, hence coming across this site.

  3. Paul is an objective journalist who does his best to be factual. When he dares to criticize Apple products as being less than perfect, people attack him personally. Gruber basically blogs in such a way as to create conflict and drive traffic to his site.

    I’ve read nearly everything Paul has written and I think that if you care about such things, you’d find that he criticizes Microsoft products far more than he does Apple products. That matches the criteria of being objective. Historically, Microsoft has had some bad products. But they also produce some wonderful products and Paul also points that out. Similarly, Apple generally produces great products, but occasionally has products that could use some improvement. Paul tends to praise Apple for their successes and point out areas for improvement–just like he does for Microsoft. Nit-picking his posts to somehow prove otherwise is more just a demonstration of partisanship on the part of the blogger or commenter.

    The world isn’t black and white, good vs. evil, us vs. them. We also are no longer in 7th grade, so resorting to personal attacks and talking about back-peddling etc. is embarrassingly juvenile. Thankfully, there are enough of us mature, objective software professionals out here to offset the silly personal 7th grade antics. And most of us are able to objectively recognize the success and faults of every product, whether Microsoft or Apple. Both companies build great products and neither builds products that have no faults. So no real need to be partisan or a shill, or to accuse others of being partisan or shills. That is, unless you’d rather just be back in 7th grade again.

    1. Paul Thurrott is far from being objective as he is often contradicting himself.
      As for John Gruber, he’s not afraid to be rude.

      If Paul Thurrott were objective Rob Enderle is insightful just like Carlos Mencia being funny.

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